Hayley Hobson: All right. Hello my friends, I'm Hayley Hobson and I'm so glad you're here. Welcome to the 10/10 podcast where I help ambitious women just like you look and feel younger so you can achieve a 10 out of 10 lifestyle and unlock your financial freedom. Today we're going to talk about one of my favorite subjects, sleep, because I was literally an insomniac for about 20 years until I got it dialed in and sleep is one of the most essential parts of being alive and living vibrantly other than breathing, food, and water. And since sleep is literally the time when our bodies process the emotions in our body and recover and actually repair themselves internally, it is really mega important. And it's kind of funny when I think back on the days like when I was in college, we would like pride ourselves on how little we slept, like I have Friday night with three hours, like we just didn't understand how much we were destroying our bodies back then.
Hayley Hobson: And yet somehow even today it's the first thing we negotiate and often the last thing that we truly understand, am I right? So today I'm going to dive into some of the sleep helpers that I've been loving lately and the main topic is going to be around cannabinoids. So you can begin to understand which products will knock you out in a good way, of course, and which products will actually optimize your sleep and your deep rest and which products will help you wake up feeling restored versus drowsy. So I'm joined today by the founder of Cured Nutrition to unpack the difference between the different compounds that a lot of people often lump together, including CBD, CBN, THC, did I say CBG? CBD, CBG, CBN, THC and hemp. And we'll get into the topic of quality as well and why some products look similar on the surface, but they can affect your body in a radically different way and how cured products actually differ from what you'd get in a cannabis dispensary.
Hayley Hobson: So if you've ever slept eight hours and or even seven and still feel tired, this conversation will probably change the way that you think about sleep entirely. So please join me in introducing Joseph Sheehy to the show. Hi, Joseph.
Joseph Sheehy: Thank you for having me. I love that intro.
Hayley Hobson: That was amazing. Yeah. I'm just going to give you, I'm going to introduce you. I'm just going to give my audience here a little quick, brief intro about who you are and where you came from. You and I chatted before we started today and it feels like we have a little bit of the same background. I know that you're a former NASA aerospace engineer and I'm not, but you are also a nationally distinguished physique competitor and a forward-thinking entrepreneur.
Hayley Hobson: And during your seven years in professional engineering, you created, you contributed to a lot of projects sitting on the surface of Mars, orbiting Jupiter and slated to carry the next generation of astronauts into space. But I also know that you have an extensive, and not to diminish, that's huge. But I also know that you dealt with a lot of your own issues in your body, whether it be nutrition or whether it be depression. And you had gone very introspective into your own practices like me. And because of these lifelong struggles, you actually, this was like your moment of entry or setting fire to change the world through now what you've contributed to with Cured Nutrition. So yeah, why don't you tell us a little bit first about, a little bit about you and Cured and why you created it?
Joseph Sheehy: Yeah, I, it's so funny because, you know, before we hopped on, before we started recording, we talked about our past lives and, you know, to get where you got and to get where I got to be a NASA contributing engineer, it took a lot of work. And when I finally got to that place, the, the seven years that I did spend were, were not for nothing. But there was a point at which I got to where I said, man, I worked so hard for this. And part of my backstory where when I struggled with depression and anxiety and almost actually committed suicide was a, was a chapter that was, if it didn't unfold the way it did, I would have never become an engineer. I would never be here today. So I'm thankful for all of these chapters.
Joseph Sheehy: But also I got to the point where I was like, I did everything that I thought I was supposed to do for the world. Like the world says, go get the degree, become an engineer, become a lawyer, you know, whatever it is, and you get into the place. And I also would share the things that I was doing with which you, you shared so, so kindly in the intro saying, I was working on these projects, contributing to bringing astronauts to space and so on. And I would be recognized, but I would feel empty inside. And so like the outside world was telling me like, you did it, like you worked so hard. You're the engineer, you're in the place that you're supposed to be.
Joseph Sheehy: And you're supposed to be, you're supposed to be happy because you did what you were supposed to do. But I wasn't, I felt so empty inside. And to tie this to why cured exists today is to look back at when I was finishing college, because that's where I was really struggling with depression. And when I was struggling with depression, it, it, it stemmed from anxiety that I didn't know how to control. And so I controlled it in many different ways, but two of the ways being alcohol and substance abuse. And I would be like a chameleon.
Joseph Sheehy: I would just, I would, I would blend in with the people around me and form to them, which also included substance abuse, which was my way to get through my anxiety. And it ultimately led me to depression. But one night, 2012, uh, in April of 2012, I actually got to such a dark place that I was stumbling home after a long night. It was a Tuesday morning, actually at 2 30 AM. And I had climbed over the guardrail of a bridge and I was standing on the edge of a bridge with my toes hanging off, ready to jump off and end my life. And I was actually basically on this whole walk home coming in and out of a blackout.
Joseph Sheehy: I was so far gone, but I came out of the blackout recognize I'm standing on the edge of a bridge. There was somebody down below on the rocks, uh, underneath the bridge that stopped me and asked, Hey, can I, can I come up to the, to the bridge and talk to you and pull you back over? And I just, I crumbled and I started crying and I was holding onto the guardrail and he climbed up the rocks and pulled me over. And that night I got walked home after being pulled over the guardrail, I took a handful of Xanax. And the next day I woke up in the hospital under 24 hour surveillance for, for suicide watch. And the weeks and months afterward were the most like standard prescribed millions of Americans go through the same route.
Joseph Sheehy: And it was medication. Like that's where you're going to go. Like, you're going to go see your psychiatrist. You're going to take medication. That's the answer. But it didn't look at all the other areas of my life where I, the areas of my life where I wasn't working out, I wasn't taking care of myself. I wasn't properly fueling myself with nutrition. And so it, it led to a couple of years of in and out of darkness in and out of depression, but also just complete frustration with this system that instantly put me on a medication because it didn't help me.
Joseph Sheehy: Things just got worse. I felt numb. I felt disconnected from myself. And I really started to question if this was ever going to work for me. And I really started to question how many other people are in this exact same experience. And so the months turned into years and I started competing, which you shared.
Joseph Sheehy: I started doing physique competitions, met a lot of people in the health and wellness world. Bodybuilding kind of became my escape. Like I could, I could feel all the pain and I could go lift and I could, I could move through like the difficulty that I felt on the inside. But that ultimately led to seven years later sitting in corporate America, my cubicle, and I had moved through my depression and worked to naturally help myself. But I also felt this emptiness inside. And so when I was there seven years into, into my career, having worked to help my mental health and my physical health, but also like was in this place where I was like, okay, I'm feeling like I'm depressed again.
Joseph Sheehy: And I, and I couldn't figure out what was going on, but it was the fact that I was in a place that I didn't really want to be anymore. And so myself, after having done a lot of the healing work myself, I wanted to share it with other people. But every single day I woke up and at 5am went into work and sat in a cubicle. And so I had this idea of what I wanted to do and who I wanted to be. But every single day I was showing up and sitting in a cubicle and I was just completely frustrated with life. And as I started to get depressed again, I recognized that I needed to do something about it because that split self, when you have a person, when you want to be one person, but you show up every day and your actions aren't in alignment with being that person, that is the greatest opportunity for anxiety and depression to come in.
Joseph Sheehy: And I've recognized that. And so long story short, I ended up putting a letter of resignation in after a couple of difficult weeks with the boss. I was being belittled. It was very clear. Like I was one foot in one foot out and didn't want to be there. And after I put in my letter of resignation, I had had this idea, which is now cured today, but I hadn't actually executed on it yet.
Joseph Sheehy: And what inspired me to take this path was Dr. Andrew Weil, who talks a lot about natural healing. He wrote a book called Spontaneous Healing. He's the founder of True Food. He was one of the very first people to say that marijuana has a huge potential to help people with anxiety and many other things. But he was basically like shut off by most of society. He was also very interested in herbs and natural healing through food, through fish oils, through sun.
Joseph Sheehy: And so he inspired me to create what is now cured today. So I put in my letter of resignation. I woke up the next day. I had this idea that I needed to rebrand cannabis because most people think of it and they carry a stigma around it. And now, seven years later, we've focused on traditional herbalism combined with cannabinoids to create products to help people with stress management and sleep. It's a long intro or explanation of how I got to where I am, but it was through this difficulty of recognizing that depression was a very dark place for me.
Joseph Sheehy: I knew other people struggled with it. And I knew other people were not being served by this traditional system. And so I stepped out of it and I wanted to share it with other people. That's what we're doing today at Cured.
Hayley Hobson: I love that. It's very similar and different to my story because I shared with you that I was a corporate bankruptcy attorney and I was dealing with my own bout of depression and anxiety on traditional medications. I studied with Andrew also. I went literally into food and nutrition, and that helped me really find my way. And then it's like, I don't know. We don't need to dive into it today, but I'd love to on another time since we both live in Colorado and spend time in North County, San Diego, talk about our parents, because obviously there was something in both of our families that made us feel like we had to do what other people projected on us versus finding that coherence between our brain, our heart, and our own gut, because we do have the power to know what we need.
Hayley Hobson: And great that you took that leap, no pun intended. And there's been lots of, I'm sure, parallels in both of our lives where it was like we had to go through the pain to get to where we are today. But in order, you're the kind of person, I'm the kind of person, like we can't live a life that doesn't feel authentic to us. And it's just like, I feel like I'm crawling out of my skin when I'm not living my truth and we just have to listen to ourselves. So good for you. Congratulations.
Hayley Hobson: Let's dive right into cannabis. And I think there is like a lot of taboo about it. And there's a lot of misconception around what is a cannabinoid? What's the difference between marijuana and cannabis? Does all cannabinoids have THC in them? What is THC? Does it mean that it's a drug and it's mind-altering?
Hayley Hobson: What is hemp? I'd love to dive into that distinction between all of that, really break it down for everybody, and then talk about the specific benefits and why you're using them in some of your products.
Joseph Sheehy: Yeah. So I think the best place to start is to define cannabis, hemp and marijuana. So cannabis is basically like the genus or the species. And then if you were like looking at like a pyramid or like a family tree, hemp and marijuana are both below cannabis. So hemp and marijuana are both cannabis. The difference between the two is really the THC concentration.
Joseph Sheehy: And so marijuana is cannabis with typically greater than 0.3% THC, but it's actually much higher. It's typically like 10 to 15% total THC concentration. And marijuana is what you find state by state sold in dispensaries and regulated state by state. Now hemp, which is what we extract all of our cannabinoids from typically has lower concentrations of THC, less than 0.3% by law, but potentially even lower and then higher concentrations of CBD and some of the other cannabinoids that you were mentioning. That's the main difference between the two. So think marijuana intoxicating because THC is more of the intoxicating cannabinoid and caveat at certain levels, which we will talk about.
Joseph Sheehy: And then marijuana, sorry, that's marijuana. And then hemp is typically used for industrial purposes, but you can breed it to have high dose CBD and very low dose THC. So we sell hemp derived extract in both of those. There's over a hundred known cannabinoids that can show up in the cannabis plant. And so CBD is one of them known for its calming properties. It helps a lot of people get to sleep and stay asleep.
Joseph Sheehy: It also has anti-inflammatory like properties. So you can also think about CBD. You can almost think about it like a vitamin that you take over time, similar to like turmeric. Turmeric has great anti-inflammatory like properties, but that's CBD and CBD is non-intoxicating. Now CBG, which you mentioned, CBN, THC, and THCA, THCV. Those are all other cannabinoids found in the plant, which show up in different concentrations, but in full spectrum.
Hayley Hobson: And there's hundreds of cannabinoids, aren't there? Like hundreds of cannabinoids. And then these are the specific ones that are like popular right now because of the healing effects in the body, correct?
Joseph Sheehy: A hundred percent. And they're the most, uh, they're the most abundant in the current strains of hemp that exists. So what I mean by that is like, if you take the extract, you extract all the cannabinoids from the hemp plant based on the genetics of the plant, you're typically going to see higher CBD and very low CBC, CBG, CBN, THC. And that's just because of the genetics of the plant, but they all have therapeutic benefits. And so when you use all of them together and you have a whole plant extract, which basically just means the less you refine the extract, the more cannabinoids are going to show up, but also the flavonoids, flavonoids, and all the other phytonutrients, basically like the terpene smell profiles, almost like, uh, you think like an essential oil is like, it is similar.
Joseph Sheehy: It's like a terpene, but those all have benefits as well. And so when you have a whole plant extract, what you have is you have the terpenes, you have the flavonoids, you have the phyto cannabinoids, and then you have all of these, uh, different cannabinoids that we were just talking about at different concentrations. But when you use all of those together, what you get is called, um, full spectrum hemp extract, which is basically just means it's not refined. The more you refine it, the closer it gets to like an isolated powder, which is not what we're trying to do. We're trying to keep it as whole plant extract as possible. So that's the difference between the two.
Hayley Hobson: Do you want to get into the nuances of like CBN THC and like the effects of them? I think that's like a high level definition, but yeah, I would, I'd love to, because honestly, when I first started researching this myself and I would go into a dispensary to add on and supplement my sleep, I really didn't know the difference between any of these. And the, you know, people are super helpful in the dispensary is like, obviously like there's the Sativa versus the Indigo. And on, if you're doing the Indigo to go to sleep, like, you know, this one has CBD and CBN and CBG, this one has it with THC and this one doesn't. So it was a lot to process and a lot to learn. And I didn't really understand what was going to be the complete product, quote unquote, that would help me not only fall asleep, but stay in a deep sleep.
Hayley Hobson: And I was like, well, if I'm using another product that acts as a cannabinoid in the body, do I need it to come from the home plant? Like, so yes, go deep. Cause I just feel like there's a lot of confusion in this area. And because there's confusion, I think that that's why there is taboo on the whole spectrum when there really doesn't need to be.
Joseph Sheehy: Yeah. So, so we talked about CBD non-intoxicating typically used for its calming properties. And, uh, a lot of people will use it for like general recovery. Now, THC is known as the intoxicating cannabinoid. It is more known for its instantaneous onset. So if you use THC, like if you were to vaporize it or you were to smoke it, it's going to have a quick onset, but also in an edible, it has more of the instantaneous relieving effects.
Joseph Sheehy: Now the caveat here is that high concentrations, that's what people associate with quote unquote being high at low concentrations though. And there was a study through Johns Hopkins that actually showed this at upwards of about three milligrams THC is shown to be non-intoxicating and not impairing. So what it's doing is it's giving you relief and relaxation without impairing you. And that's where the nuance comes in is because most people think THC, I'm going to get high, but it's the dose that matters. And so low concentration and in cured products, we don't put more than a milligram in our products. Whereas you would typically see in a dispensary, like five milligrams or 10 milligrams.
Joseph Sheehy: So like a fifth to a 10th of a standard dose of THC is what you find in our products. Cause it gives you the relief and relaxation. Now, CBN is another cannabinoid that's actually, it's more sedating. And so I always explain CBN, like it's, it's like you're way laying underneath a weighted blanket. Your body just feels like it has like this heavy feeling, but it's calmed as well. So CBD more like mind calming CBN more like body calming and then THC more instantaneous relief.
Joseph Sheehy: And then at high concentrations is what gets you high. But the nuance is, is that it actually is really important at low concentrations in a full spectrum hemp extract. Now, CBC and CBG CBG has been looked at a little bit as like a vasodilator almost CBC has been looked at as more of like a antimicrobial. But the main point is that all of these cannabinoids have different therapeutic benefits. And we're really just in the early years of figuring out what they all really do. And as the federal laws change, more research will be able to be done.
Joseph Sheehy: But most importantly, like those three that we talked about CBD, CBN, THC, those are the most important ones to look at for supporting your sleep. And then the concentration is what really matters.
Hayley Hobson: CBG is in some products to help sleep as well though, isn't it?
Joseph Sheehy: Um, it is, but more people think it's stimulating and uplifting than actually relaxing. So you typically will see it in more of like the sativa based products that you were mentioning earlier.
Hayley Hobson: Okay. Okay. Um, so when you say like less, would you consider anything less than three milligrams, a micro dose, or would you say like one to two milligrams really? Like where, where is that differentiation where people call it like a dose versus a micro dose?
Joseph Sheehy: I, I really think that one milligram is a micro dose. Um, you know, typical micro dosing in the like plant medicine world is saying, take a standard dose and divide it by 10. So 10 milligrams of THC, that's a pretty heavy dose for me, but that's like a standard dose that you would get in an edible that somebody is trying to get high. So a 10th of that is like a micro dose. Um, you get more than that. Like some people still won't feel the effects of it. So it is dependent on the person, but those Johns Hopkins studies were testing at basically five milligrams, 0.8 milligrams, 2.1 or sorry.
Joseph Sheehy: It was like 5.8, 1.5, 2.8, all the way up to like 3.7, but they showed that it wasn't impairing up to the three milligram range. So you could call it micro dose. But I think that from my perspective, you really don't need much more than a milligram to get the benefit without the, uh, high that most people associate with like getting in it, taking the edible.
Hayley Hobson: And does it depend on somebody's body? Cause I have a, I have a friend who's on the smaller size and like, she can take an edible and if she, she can't take anything more than 2.5 or she feels intoxicated where I took 2.5, I wouldn't feel anything.
Joseph Sheehy: Yeah. And it also depends on like, if you're taking it with a healthy fat cannabinoids are fat soluble. So if you're, you know, you're eating like an avocado or MCT oil or something like that, that actually helps your body process the cannabinoids. So it could be like dependent on the weight. It could be dependent on the diet, what you ate it with. If you took it before a meal or after a meal, there's a lot of nuance there for sure.
Hayley Hobson: Okay. Interesting. All right. So all the cured products are in a microdose form. That's it. Correct. With THC.
Hayley Hobson: Yeah. We don't have any, anything more than a microdose. Okay.
Hayley Hobson: So let's talk about a little bit about the difference between the cured products and what is available to purchase at a dispensary. Cause I know that people who don't know about your products are probably walking into a dispensary. It's what I did before I found you. And it's hard to know what you're getting there. Even the packaging, even if you do know how to read the labels, sometimes the packaging is so confusing.
Joseph Sheehy: Yeah, it is. And for the most part, you're most likely not going to find microdose products in dispensaries because most people are going into a dispensary to get high. Unfortunately, there's nothing wrong with that. I don't judge like to each their own, but like, that's not what we're focused on. So we're focused on wellness first. We're a supplement brand and we're focused on wellness and wellness education first.
Joseph Sheehy: And so what we did was in 2019, we hired a clinical herbalist to help create our formulations. And we did that because you could walk into a dispensary, you could walk into a grocery store, you could shop online for supplements. And there are what's called the trendy ingredients, right? So it's like, this has this in it. It's going to sell the product. It's because it has whatever. And what most companies do in the supplement world and in the, uh, I don't see this as much in the, in the marijuana world, but it happens in both is like, this is popular.
Joseph Sheehy: Let's throw it together. It's like kitchen sink, product design, and it will sell well because we have these ingredients in it for us. When we hired our clinical herbalist, what we said was we want to take a traditional herbalist approach and understand how all the herbs that we believe we can put into this product, not that we're going to put all of them in, but the ones that we believe we can put in, how those will not only work together, but we'll also work together with the other products that we sell. So we can build like a full daily support system for helping mental clarity, for gut health, for stress support and sleep. So our clinical herbalist, she's used to working one-on-one with clients. You know, if, uh, if a client is going through menopause or struggling with something, um, with sleep, like she will create a very custom formula for them.
Joseph Sheehy: But when we talked to her, we said, we want to be able to scale what you do to mass market as effective as possible. So every product that we bring to market takes about a year to a year and a half to develop. And we are very, very stringent in our supply chain testing. So we make sure that at every step of the supply chain, we're testing our ingredients. And then before we ever accept our products into inventory, it has to go through third-party testing again, to prove that what we say is in the product is actually in the product. And all of that comes at a premium because what that does is it makes us confident that when somebody takes our product, it's going to work for them.
Joseph Sheehy: And they're going to continue to come back. That's the main difference when it comes to pricing. And I think most importantly is we've just been really focused on quality and quality control, which impacts our margins. It's not cheap for us to do what we do, but then that also dictates the price point. And it makes it very clear that from our perspective, we want to drive holistic wellness.
Joseph Sheehy: And if you walk into a dispensary, most of the time, it's how much THC can I get? Can I get as much as possible to get as high as possible? That's the complete different direction from what we're doing.
Hayley Hobson: Some people go into a dispensary to buy sleep products, but I hear what you're saying. They could be five milligrams or 10 milligrams. But what I'm hearing you say is that, because somebody who's trying to go to sleep is not necessarily trying to get high unless their highness pulls them into sleep. I don't know. But what I'm hearing you say is that what standard products may do in a dispensary is like, okay, I'm going to get the CBN and I'm going to get the THC and I'm going to the CBD.
Hayley Hobson: I'm going to throw it together and I'm going to make it as cheap as possible. And it may not be free from pesticides. It may not actually do what it's supposed to do, but it's got the ingredients and nobody will know. So I'm just going to put it on the label and the label's correct. So it's not like we're doing anything illegal. And then that's that.
Hayley Hobson: And I'll give you 10, depending like 10 to 20, if it's five milligrams, 10 milligrams, 10 to 20 gummies or whatever in the box or the packaging. So you, what you guys are doing is you're paying a lot more attention to other additional ingredients. So yes, there is that microdose of THC and yes, we're going to get the CBN and the products, but we also have nutritional ingredients and adaptogens and functional mushrooms and things that are going to actually support your body. And when I did the math myself, because I'm, I love your product and I'm sharing it with people and people give me like, well, I can get this for 20 bucks and this one is 60. Well, yeah, but you're getting a third in your little thing that you get in the dispensary of what's actually in their bag because Bursa will only giving you 10 and in the cured bag, they're giving you 30. And then in the cured bag that gives you 30, you're also getting it packed with other ingredients.
Hayley Hobson: So you, it's not even comparing apples to apples.
Joseph Sheehy: Yeah, and those other ingredients really matter. Like if you take THC, so like in our serenity gummies, for example, if you take a low dose THC or even a higher dose THC, but you take it with L-theanine, which is another ingredient in our serenity gummies, we also have ashwagandha and reishi mushroom, but you add in those other ingredients and the negative effects that people typically feel with THC, like, oh, this is actually just going to make me anxious, or it's going to make me paranoid. You combine it with L-theanine, you combine it with ashwagandha, that helps regulate your central nervous system. So you get the relief effects without the paranoia or the anxiety that many people feel from an edible. So like the main difference is you're a hundred percent right is the clinical herbalist strategy and product formulation that we put into it.
Joseph Sheehy: But what that really does is it creates a very specific function. You could take one milligram of THC and 15 milligrams of CBN, which is what is in serenity gummies. And then you could take a serenity gummy and they do not feel the same. They feel completely different because of those other ingredients and how they work in combination. And so similar to how we were saying like full spectrum extract is a bunch of cannabinoids and terpenes and flavonoids, and they all work together. That's true.
Joseph Sheehy: And then it becomes even more true when you start to add other functional ingredients into it. So that's the approach that we took because we knew that we needed to create better function while also understanding the therapeutic benefits of cannabinoids. So we wanted to combine the two.
Hayley Hobson: It's kind of like, you know, when wonder white bread came out in the market and everybody's all like excited about it, but it's like, great, you've just stripped it down. So there's nothing in there that's new of nutritional value versus having a whole grain, completely organic bread that you can eat. And that's going to be good for you, not give you gut problems. And it's actually going to have fiber and protein and nutrition in it.
Joseph Sheehy: Yeah. And to be like completely honest to pack all of the adaptogens and other herbs into a gummy like we do is very difficult because gummies, the more powder you try to put in them, the harder it is to get them to set in the mold. So you could try to put a bunch of ingredients together, but the gummy is just not going to form and it's going to fall apart. So like the science that went behind actually creating these. And when we worked with our manufacturer, it took a very long time to dial them in because the other component of all of this, and this is probably in more of the world of like creatine gummies and other gummies that are out there is they say that there has, there's a certain level of ingredient in this product, but I can guarantee you like 80 to 90% of those are not true.
Hayley Hobson: It doesn't burn off when you're cooking the gummy, like a lot of the nutritional value. If you don't do it the right way, it just burns. It absolutely can.
Joseph Sheehy: Yeah. Yeah. And like in the supplement world, I actually commend the marijuana world because the marijuana world has more testing than all of the supplement world. There's just general supplement world. There are no testing standards. There are no testing requirements. And so most people taking supplements are taking a bunch of things that may not even have what they claim to have in them. And then you're just wasting your money even, even more because you're taking five different supplements and who knows what's really in them and who knows at what concentration.
Joseph Sheehy: And so that's why we said we want to combine these therapeutic ingredients all into one product. And it is going to come at a premium price, but we know that the effect is so good that people will continue to come back for it. And so that's true that you could get something cheaper at a dispensary with the cannabinoid concentration, but I would say the quality of product is, is not comparable.
Hayley Hobson: And are you suggesting that people use your products? Cause I know you've got, you talked about the serenity gummy, which is the lower you said was at point. That's a milligram of THC.
Joseph Sheehy: And then you've got the dream that doubles it, right? Dream has a 1.25 milligrams, but it has CBN in it. So you add CBN into it. Then that's more of like shut your body down at the end of the night.
Hayley Hobson: Yeah. So are you suggesting that people combine those products as a system with your nightcap product, which is more CBN or your Zen product with the adaptogens, or do you suggest one or the other? Cause I actually mixed them all together.
Joseph Sheehy: Well, that was, that was what we went to our herbalist with was like, not everybody just is going to be able to, you know, not everybody just like, it only needs stress support or sleep support. They're going to want both. So the products were designed to be used together. And the other component of this is they're, they're very safe. So you can combine a nightcap, which has five milligrams of CBN with serenity or dream because you want more CBN. And you notice for you that maybe that helps you into a, like a deeper sleep.
Joseph Sheehy: We designed them all to be used together if you need to, because again, like you've said, everybody is going to respond different and some people are going to need more than, than others.
Hayley Hobson: And just for you guys who are listening out there, if you haven't had CBN in your products so far, like it is the best, like CBN makes you feel like you're literally like I, sometimes I try to fight it just to see if I can stay awake, but it's just like, all right, I can't take this until nine o'clock. Cause in 20 minutes, I'm going to be like out. And I love that.
Joseph Sheehy: Well, does that weighted blanket analogy make sense to you? Cause it's like, that's what, when you lay under a weighted blanket, it's like, this is heavy. You're like getting sucked into your bed. Yes. I love it. Yeah. Yeah.
Hayley Hobson: Yeah. All right. Well, let's, let's, let's pop over to, I heard last night I was listening to his, I mean, last night, last week I was listening to a zoom and that's when I first met you and, or you didn't meet me, but I saw you and we, you, you were talking about this ban that is going on. That's about to go on or is going on right now on all hemp products, like the ones that are manufactured at cured or other companies like you. And when I started to listen to it, like my ears perked up. Cause I was like, oh my gosh, this is so typical of legislation who like the alcohol, I like the way I equate it was the alcohol industry. Doesn't feel like they're making enough money anymore because the younger generations now are queued in that alcohol is terrible for your body.
Hayley Hobson: So they are deviating towards more hemp like products to get that either uplifting or high, like feeling or sleep, you know, sleep quality. And so their industry is suffering. So they're going to now try to ban all of the products that you guys sell or that other companies like you sell. And I was horrified. So I just wanted to dive in a little deeper with you and find out, is that true? What's going on?
Hayley Hobson: How did that happen?
Joseph Sheehy: Yeah, it's very unfortunate and it's, it's multifaceted because one component that I touched on briefly on that call is, is important. And then I'll talk about the, the alcohol industry as well, but there are companies out there that are selling high dose hemp derived edibles that have 10 to 15 milligrams of THC in them, and they're just selling them online. Now the marijuana operators that are regulated state by state are very frustrated with the hemp operators that basically tried to expose a loophole and are now selling products online that are dangerous and could be, if they could just be purchased by a kid and they are intoxicating, or you could walk into a gas station and buy a 30 milligram edible. That's not how it should be regulated. So the marijuana industry is frustrated because the hemp industry, part of the hemp industry exposed a loophole and took it way too far.
Joseph Sheehy: And I don't agree with any of that because that's not going to serve people. If people want that, they go into dispensary. You live in a state where it's regulated and you go in, you share your ID and that's fine. So that's one component of it. But the other component is that the alcohol industry is losing lots of money. I want to say that the stat was like over the last four years, it was over like 800 billion in, in declining sales, which has a lot of money.
Joseph Sheehy: So of course, if people are leaving alcohol, stress isn't going away. So what are people turning to? People are turning to low dose products like the ones that we sell to get stress relief and calming without getting intoxicated and then sleep at night, wake up refreshed and go back and tackle their dreams the next day. And that's what it's happening in culture. There's a huge cultural shift away from alcohol, but what happened was the lobbying was done with the alcohol industry. Part of the marijuana industry also didn't want the hemp industry to exist.
Joseph Sheehy: So this sweeping ban came in the bill that opened the government in November of last year. So the government was shut down. It was shut down for a completely different reason, but it had a provision slipped into it at the last minute that basically redefined hemp. And so now if nothing changes at the end of this year, it's going to be almost completely impossible to have any dose of THC in a hemp derived product. It's impossible for the farmers to farm. It's impossible for the extraction facilities to do what they need to do.
Joseph Sheehy: And then it's almost impossible for us to create a final product that has the same benefit and impact as they do now. If we're completely removing THC, the nuance is, is that there is a level where it is intoxicating and there's a level at which it is not. And so we need to define that. But right now, basically 95% of the hemp derived cannabinoid industry is going to be wiped out if nothing changes. And there are forces from all over that are lobbying against us, but it was, there was a lot from the bourbon industry and we all know how government works is like money talks. And so lobbying happened and basically our whole industry was potentially wiped out.
Joseph Sheehy: Like it is law and there's a ticking time bomb. November 13th of this year is the last day that we could exist if nothing changes. So what we're working to do is just create the awareness of what a full spectrum hemp product is, what low dose THC does, the fact that it's not impairing. And also the fact that there are so many people that are turning away from alcohol and just want a holistic alternative that's not intoxicating to support their stress and to support their sleep. That's it. But right now we're being threatened at the highest level and it's a, it's an existential threat.
Joseph Sheehy: Like we need to campaign and lobby ourselves to educate because if we can educate and show who our user base is, our user base, like for the most part is like 30 to 45 women that at the end of the day want to be able to relax. They want to be present with their kids. They don't want to reach for wine. They don't want to be intoxicated. And so we have to be able to serve that individual. But right now, the way things changed, we could be completely gone by the end of this year if nothing changes.
Hayley Hobson: You mean, I mean, not completely gone because you have gut health products, you have focused, like you mean like the ones that the THC in them would be gone.
Joseph Sheehy: Yeah. 90, which is 92% of our sales. So I would be starting a company from, from ground zero basically. Um, so not completely gone. I should say that. Thanks for the, thanks for the caveat, but yeah, our THC free products would not be gone.
Joseph Sheehy: Um, but here's the thing is that at low doses, it is so beneficial and full spectrum, whole plant extract. That's not refined and going through a bunch more processing is always going to have low doses of THC. So if we're not going to allow that our whole industry of whole plant, full spectrum hemp extract is just gone. It can't exist. Uh, so it's, it's, there's a lot of work that we need to do, but we have to educate at the highest level because politicians don't understand these nuances and we, it's our responsibility to say, Hey, like this is why I use the product.
Joseph Sheehy: This is how I use the product. This is who I am. This is why I left alcohol. This is why I left all these other things that weren't serving me. And if they can understand that, then it starts to change the narrative around what's actually going on in the industry.
Joseph Sheehy: I think all the synthetic cannabinoids and all the high dose hemp products that have like 20, 30 milligrams of THC that needs to be gone because that's not safe and it should be sold in a dispensary. But what we do at cured is very strategically focused on health and wellness. And we've got work to do to make sure that we preserve our strategy and, and, and our place in the industry.
Hayley Hobson: Yeah, that's super helpful. Is there anything that we here listening can do to support you?
Joseph Sheehy: Yeah. So we started a public advocacy group. It's called the national coalition for responsible cannabinoid access. It's just N C R C a dot U S. If you're a user of any of our products or any products similar to ours, you can go to that website and first just share testimonials because those are what we're going to work to bring to the white house to share what would happen if our customers or people like our customers lose access to our products, because it's emotional to read what people say would happen to them if they lost access to our products.
Joseph Sheehy: And so that needs to be understood. We are aligning with several other companies in the industry that are working to change the laws. So right now I'd be speaking a little bit prematurely on, on what's to do next, but there's a bill that's being pushed forward by Senator Griffith that is working to create this framework that one extends the band extends the ban to give us time to create regulations. And with the hope that we end up somewhere around this two milligram range. So you can go to there are many places, but like, if you can find the Griffith bill based on where you're located, you have to talk to your local Congress, men and women, but co-sponsoring that bill, making sure that Congress members are pushing forward and co-sponsoring the Griffith bill would be the most help of anything.
Hayley Hobson: Thank you. I appreciate that. You know, I'll do that. I have spent like 40 years of my life trying to figure out why the government is kind of trying to control the healthy things that we're putting in our body. And I, my background, as I shared with you beforehand was a mess before I had access to products like this. So this would be super disappointing to have something like this happen to those of us who want to get rid of information in our body in a way that works without all the side effects or want to sleep at night, basically just want to be healthy.
Hayley Hobson: So thanks for the information. I'm, I'm so glad that you're at the forefront of this through these changes. And for those of you listening now's the time to do something about it and also to stock up on these products. So hopefully they'll be around for a long time, but in case they work, we, we know that, I mean, in case, in case they won't, we know that they do work and that they can truly support you. So I've created a link here for you to go ahead and grab them at Hayley Hobson.com. That's H A Y L E Y two Y's in my first name, Hayley Hobson.com forward slash cured and cured is spelled how you'd expect it.
Hayley Hobson: So you are eating and they like, like Joseph said, they have all kinds of different products and whether you're looking for sleep, whether you're looking for gut, whether you're looking for focus. Now that you understand the difference between different cannabinoids and how they affect your nervous system, you can pick out what you feel like would be more supportive to you. And also just, if it's also given us a 15% discount with my name at checkout, Hayley at checkout. So you'll use the Hayley Hobson.com forward slash cured. And then at checkout, use my name and you'll get 15% off your purchase. H A Y L E Y.
Hayley Hobson: And I'm telling you, I have always used these, well, not these products until I found these, but cannabinoids. And for those of you who know Copaiba, which we've talked about before mimics a cannabinoid response in your body. And when you add CBN and CBG, it's like a whole nother level. It's changed the way that I've slept. So I know it'll change the way you sleep too. You can reach out to me anytime.
Hayley Hobson: My contact information is on my website, Hayley Hobson.com. You can find me on Instagram at Hayley Hobson on Facebook, Hayley Hobson, whole you TikTok. I am Hayley Hobson, cured nutrition is at cured nutrition on Instagram. And we'd love your support. The gift of health is always meant to be shared. So thank you, Joe, for sharing with us. And until next time, my friends, I will see you online.
Joseph Sheehy: Thank you, Hayley. Appreciate it.